Macron riles Russia with documentary releasing content of Putin calls

Authored by lemonde.fr and submitted by notbatmanyet

Meeting between Russian President Vladimir Putin and his French counterpart Emmanuel Macron, in Moscow, on February 7, 2022. AP

Unashamed to create scenes on the international stage, French President Emmanuel Macron sometimes takes liberties with the levels of secrecy that are usually enforced in diplomatic affairs. Even if it means causing a few incidents.

Russian state news agency Ria Novosti, a conduit for Russian President Vladimir Putin, recently alluded to the France 2 broadcast of A President, Europe and the War. In this documentary filmed in the heart of the Elysée Palace and scheduled to air on Thursday, June 30, director Guy Lagache was allowed to record the entire conversation between the French president and his Russian counterpart. With excerpts from this call having been published in the last few days across various media, the Russian agency took offense and stated on Twitter that "for a long time the French have not respected the diplomatic rules of negotiations."

The filmed exchange took place on February 20, four days before the war. Mr. Lagache followed the almost two-hour-long interview from the office of the head of the diplomatic cell of the Élysée, Emmanuel Bonne. He recorded as Mr. Macron tried to push Mr. Putin to an agreement "in principle" to meet with Joe Biden in Geneva.

The film includes nine riveting minutes in which the Russian president explained that the Ukrainian government "is not democratically elected" but the result of a "bloody coup d'état" during which "people were burned alive," and for which Volodymyr Zelensky "is one of those responsible." Mr. Putin said it was "always a lot of pleasure" to speak with Mr. Macron, including from his gym, and made some promises. Behind the scenes, Mr. Bonne warned Mr. Lagache that the Russian president "always lies." In fact, the meeting between the Russian and American presidents never took place.

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Was Mr. Putin warned that he was being recorded? "The question must be put to the Elysée Palace," said Mr. Lagache, who obtained privileged access, for six months, to the diplomatic cell's activities. According to Anne-Sophie Bradelle, the president's spokeswoman in charge of international affairs and one of the protagonists in the documentary, Mr. Macron's European interlocutors were warned ahead of time, over six months ago, that a journalist would be following the French presidency of the Council of the European Union from the inside. The film changed its subject at the end of February to focus on what was going on behind the scenes of the war.

As for Mr. Putin, things were not so clear. "The Russian authorities were notified after Emmanuel Bonne and myself had viewed the film," said Ms. Bradelle. An agreement was made with the production company providing that the Elysée could see the images before broadcasting (according to the diplomatic cell a passage was deleted that could have jeopardized national security secrets). A first viewing was held in May and the second just after Mr. Macron's trip to Kyiv on June 16.

"Yet again, the French publish transcripts of interviews between the two presidents," tweeted the clearly exasperated Russian state agency. During Mr. Macron's presidential campaign, a series of promotional films designed by the Elysée and broadcast on YouTube had already taken excerpts of a conversation where Mr. Zelensky asked Mr. Macron to contact his Russian counterpart. Was this a way for the Elysée to legitimize the pursuit of a dialogue with the Russian president, even though the idea was decried by Kyiv's allies, from Poland to the Baltic States? In the documentary, Mr. Macron's few uncompromising retorts to Mr. Putin cast the French president in a rather favorable light.

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This apparent breach of secrecy has therefore become a weapon between France and Russia, giving rise to varying degrees of indignation. In Paris, diplomats know how to hunt for "leaks" too. Another example took place in September 2020, when a scoop from Le Monde revealed the conversations between the two presidents about Alexei Navalny, two months after the poisoning of the Kremlin opponent. The assassination attempt, which the Russian security services are accused of having organized, cast doubts on the policy of conciliation sketched in 2019 by the French president toward Russia. At the time, Moscow had criticized Le Monde and the French Ministry of Foreign Affairs followed suit. "Any leak of confidential internal documents is unacceptable," the ministry said as it launched an internal investigation.

A year later, Paris was annoyed by the Russian Foreign Ministry publishing part of the correspondence between its boss Sergei Lavrov and two of his counterparts at the time, Jean-Yves Le Drian and Heiko Maas. In mid-November 2021, the French and German ministers had been trying to revive the Minsk agreements, in order to deprive Russia of a pretext to launch its troops – already massed on the border – to invade Ukraine. The disclosure of these letters was interpreted as a sign of Moscow's unwillingness to comply. "We consider this step as contrary to diplomatic rules and customs," said Anne-Claire Legendre, the spokesperson for the French Foreign Affairs Ministry.

In turn, a few days before the outbreak of hostilities in Ukraine, Moscow expressed annoyance with the French Foreign Affairs Ministry about reports made in Paris about Mr. Macron's visit to the Kremlin, on February 7, in his last attempt to avoid the return of war in Europe.

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That time, the incident was about the proposal made by communist members of the Duma to recognize the separatist republics of the Donbas. Mr. Macron publicly reassured that Mr. Putin had promised not to take up the idea – a claim quickly contradicted by the Kremlin and by reality. On February 21, three days before the invasion of Ukraine, Russia voted to recognize the pro-Russian entities of Donbas. "I hope we will never live in a world where we will have to publish the transcript of classified parts of conversations between presidents," said Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov, at the time.

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Ariane Chemin and Philippe Ricard Translation of an original article published in French on lemonde.fr; the publisher may only be liable for the French version.

throwawaylol666666 on July 1st, 2022 at 13:11 UTC »

What the fuck is with Putin and these tables?

Dacadey on July 1st, 2022 at 12:27 UTC »

Here is a machine translation fo their full conversation, Russian to English. Edit: just to clarify, this happened around the 20th of February, around 4 days before the war.

Edit 2: source

https://www.letemps.ch/monde/emmanuel-macron-vladimir-poutine-quatre-jours-guerre-ne-sais-juriste-appris-droit

Emmanuel Macron. Since our last conversation, tensions have continued to rise. You know my commitment to dialogue and my determination to continue it. First I would like to know your vision of the situation, and then tell me directly how we both do it, what are your intentions. Then I want to see if there are any other reasonable actions that can be taken, and what else I can offer you.

Vladimir Putin. What else can I say? You can see for yourself what's going on. You and Chancellor [Olaf] Scholz told me that [Vladimir] Zelensky was ready to make a gesture, that he had prepared a draft law for the implementation of the Minsk agreements. [...] In fact, our dear colleague Mr. Zelensky does nothing. He's lying to you. [...] I do not know if you heard his statement yesterday that Ukraine should have access to nuclear weapons.I also heard your comments at a press conference in Kiev on February 8. You said that the Minsk agreements should be revised, I quote, "so that they can be applied."

Macron: Vladimir, first of all, I never said that the Minsk agreements should be revised. I didn't say that in Berlin, Kiev, or Paris. I said that they should be accepted, and their provisions should be respected. I have a completely different idea about the events of the last few days.

Putin: Listen, Emmanuel, I don't understand what your problem is with the separatists. At least, they did everything necessary, at our insistence, to start a constructive dialogue with the Ukrainian authorities.

Macron: Regarding what you said, Vladimir, a few remarks. Firstly, the Minsk Agreements are a dialogue with you, and you are absolutely right about that. In this context, it was not expected that the basis of the discussion would be a document submitted by the separatists. So, when your negotiator tries to force Ukrainians to discuss the separatist roadmap, he shows disrespect for the Minsk agreements. The separatists are not the ones who will make proposals on [changing] Ukrainian laws.

Putin: Of course, we have a very different vision of the situation. During our last conversation, I reminded you and even read articles 9, 11 and 12 of the Minsk Agreements.

Macron: They are in front of my eyes! It clearly states that Ukraine's proposal should be agreed with representatives of certain districts of Donetsk and Luhansk regions within the framework of a trilateral meeting. This is exactly what we propose to do. So I do not know where your lawyer studied law. I just look at these texts and try to apply them! And I do not know what lawyer could tell you that in a sovereign state, the texts of laws are made up by separatist groups, and not democratically elected authorities.

Putin (in an irritated tone): This is not a democratically elected government. They came to power as a result of a coup, people burned alive there, it was a bloodbath, and Zelensky is one of those responsible for it.Listen to me carefully: the principle of dialogue is to take into account the interests of the other side. The proposal exists, the separatists, as you call them, sent it to the Ukrainians, but did not receive a response. Where is the dialogue here?

Macron: But this is because, as I told you, we are not interested in the proposals of the separatists. We ask them to respond to the proposals of Ukrainians — and everything should be done in this way, because this is the law! What you just said raises doubts about how ready you are to adhere to the Minsk Agreements if, in your opinion, you have to deal with the illegitimate power of terrorists.

Putin (still very annoyed): Listen to me carefully. Do you hear me? I'll say it again. The separatists, as you call them, reacted to the proposals of the Ukrainian authorities. They responded, but the same authorities did not follow their example.

Macron: So, okay. Based on their response to Ukraine's proposals, I suggest that we demand that all parties hold a meeting within the framework of the working group — and continue to move forward. Tomorrow we can ask for this work to be done and demand that all interested parties abandon the "empty chair" policy. However, in the last couple of days, the separatists have not expressed a desire to enter into this discussion. I will demand this from Zelensky immediately. Do we have a deal? If so, I will start and demand to arrange a meeting tomorrow.

Putin: Let's agree — as soon as we finish our conversation, I will study these proposals. But from the very beginning it was necessary to put pressure on Ukrainians, but no one wanted to do it.

Macron: Well, no, I'm doing my best to push them, you know that well.

Putin: I know, but, alas, it is ineffective.

Macron: I need you to help me a little. The situation on the contact line [of the parties to the conflict in Donbass] is very tense. I really called Zelensky yesterday and urged him to calm down. I will tell him again that everyone needs to calm down: calm down [people] on social networks, calm down the army of Ukraine. But what I still see is that you can call your troops, who are almost in position, to calm down. There was a lot of shelling yesterday. What do you say — how will the [Russian] military exercises develop?

Putin: The exercises are going according to plan.

Macron: So they will end tonight, right?

Putin: Yes, probably today, but we will definitely leave troops on the border until the situation in Donbass is resolved. The decision will be made after discussion with the Ministries of Defense and Foreign Affairs.

Macron: Good. Vladimir, I will tell you very sincerely, for me the primary task is to return the discussion to the right track and reduce the level of tension. And it's important to me — and I'm really asking you to do this — that we keep the situation under control. This is the most important thing right now. And I'm counting on you very much. Do not give in to provocations, whatever they may be in the following hours and days.

I wanted to make you two very specific suggestions. The first is to organize a meeting between you and President [Joe] Biden in Geneva in the next few days. I spoke to him on Friday night and asked if I could make you this offer. He asked me to tell you that he's ready. President Biden was also considering suitable ways to de-escalate the situation in order to take into account your requirements and clearly approach the issue of NATO and Ukraine. Name a date that suits you.

Putin: Thank you very much, Emmanuel. It is always a great pleasure and a great honor for me to talk with your European colleagues, as well as with the United States. And I am always very pleased to talk to you, because we have a trusting relationship. So, Emmanuel, I propose to replay everything. First of all, we need to prepare this meeting in advance. Only after that we will be able to talk — otherwise, if we come like this to talk about everything and nothing, everyone will just condemn us.

Macron: But can we say today, based on the outcome of these discussions, that we have generally agreed? I would like to get a clear answer from you. I understand your reluctance to name a date, but are you ready to run ahead and say: "I want to hold a bilateral meeting with the Americans, and then an expanded one with the Europeans." Or not?

Putin: This is a proposal that deserves attention, and if you want us to formulate it well, then I suggest instructing our advisers to call in order to agree [...] But on the whole I agree.

Macron: Very well, you confirmed that you agree on the whole. I suggest that our employees [...] try to prepare a joint statement, something like a press release on the results of this conversation.

Putin: To be honest, I was going to play hockey. I'm talking to you from the gym before training. But first I'll call my advisors.

Macron: Anyway, thank you, Vladimir. We'll be in touch. As soon as something clears up, call me.

Putin (in French): Thank you, Mr. President.

Educational-Nail7583 on July 1st, 2022 at 12:07 UTC »

Putin really stabbed Macron in the back during the lead up to the war. I can't blame Macron for doing this.

Putin was not negotiating in good faith.